Hi Brother Jeff,
I have a question for you in regards to Daniel 8. If you could manage to spare a few moments of your valuable time to help answer my query, I would be most appreciative. I recently listened to Brother E. give his thoughts that the chazon vision refers to the 2520, and the mareh is referring to the 2300, within the context of Daniel 8. I do see much logic in what he is saying, but I’m confused as to which 2520 it refers. In Dan 8:17 we are informed that, “at the time of the end shall be the vision.” Now if we go along with other parts of Daniel, the time of the end is 1798. That would make the chazon refer to the first 2520, unless of course this time of the end refers to 1844, as the end of the last great time prophecy, the second 2520. In verse 19 we are told that we are to “know what shall be in the last end of the indignation,” which I understand to be the end of the second 2520. I am confused because of the question that arises in verse 13 “How long shall be the vision (chazon), concerning the Daily (paganism), and the transgression of desolation (papalism), to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden underfoot? I am confused because these two desolating powers finished in 1798, and if the mareh is a snapshot of the chazon, the 2300 goes on to 1844, which is not part of this vision. Could you give some clarity to this for me please, it is probably something very simple I am overlooking, or fail to understand? With kind regards, Brother M.
Dear Brother M,
Of course it is always better to ask the one who teaches a thing what he means, rather than another, but I see the issue you are identifying, so I will give it a shot.
The Millerites saw both 2520’s but struggled on how to apply them. Some chose to apply only one, and Miller, seeing both, had some misconceptions about their relationship to each other. Therefore the Millerites discovered this truth, but the clarity concerning them is only being opened up to us now.
One thing that was not initially recognized, and may not even now be recognized by some is that the 2520, though at one level is two distinct prophecies against two kingdoms, at another level is also just one prophecy. By that I mean that they should be identified in their singular applications, but also as a whole. When we approach them as a whole, then we fithat from 723BC to 677BC was the scattering process, and from 1798 to 1844 was the gathering process. The initial forty-six years and the ending fortysix years represent the scattering and then the gathering.
When we fi Daniel 8:17 representing the time of the end in 1798, and also emphasize that this is the chazon vision, we should probably go the extra mile and explain that there are two “times” of the Gentiles, one ending in 1798 and the other in 1844. Therefore, for Gabriel to mark the time of the end in 1798, and identify that as the chazon vision, does not deny the 2520 as the chazon, for the trampling down of the sanctuary and the host ended in 1844 according to Daniel 8:14 in agreement with the “second” time of the Gentiles, and the trampling down also ended in 1798 according to Revelation 11:2 in agreement with the “first” time of the Gentiles. 1798 is the time of the end when the forty-six year period of the gathering arrived.
It is easy for us to see and understand a single day or single year for the beginning or the end of a prophecy, but what I am saying is that the forty-six year period that marks the beginning and ending of this prophecy can be correctly applied as Gabriel did in 1798, even though the full period of the gathering did not end until 1844. The forty-six years at the beginning is marking the scattering of two nations and the forty-six years at the end is marking the gathering of one nation. I, of course, am uncertain how Brother E. would answer you, so I am sending our dialogue to him, for he is generally willing to defend his own thoughts. Jeff.